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  1. #31
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    ugh I hate that you were put through all that!!!!
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  3. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by atomic sagebrush View Post
    Just to further clarify because I still feel like there is confusion here, all that hotdogz and I are urging is that people have the non-invasive screening tests first and then if something comes up awry, of course have a CVS/amnio AT THAT POINT. The risks are then justified. No one is saying that GT should not have had whatever test she wanted to have to give her peace of mind and it's not our intent to secondguess her in any way (even tho I don't think having both CVS and amnio is medically indicated or a good idea either), but just to offer recommendations for people who are newly pregnant and considering their options. GT's baby is healthy and normal and we are all thrilled about that.

    To my personal way of thinking, with these tests available (and I don't care if they are 10% or 1% or anything in between or whether they are approved by the NHS or FDA or Consumer Reports or anyone else) then there is no legitimate reason not to do it that way. Have the safe test first and then if it comes back positive, have the more risky one but keep in mind that the blood tests are only a test and may not be accurate.

    My personal opinion is that people shouldn't let the potential of a false positive, which to be sure is a stressful situation but in the end causes no real lasting harm, scare them into having an invasive test in lieu of the blood test. Both amnio and CVS can and HAVE caused real live people on this very site, to lose perfectly healthy babies.

    There are no guarantees in this life and the unfortunate fact is that tons of things can and do go wrong in pregnancies, deliveries, and early infancy that are totally outside of chromosomal abnormalities and neural tube defects detected by CVS/amnio but have lifelong consequences that are in some cases worse than the things that can be detected. So to make a decision to have highly invasive tests in the belief that you will then have 100% guarantee of a healthy baby, it is an illusion.
    Atomic, I think we are in furious agreement!

    And I completely agree with you that a clear CVS or amnio is not a guarantee of a healthy baby. Even if I had either of those tests, my son's disability would not have been picked up because it's a micro-deletion and they would have had to have been specifically looking for that, which they wouldn't have given there is no family history. Similarly, autism is not going to show up on genetic screening, nor vision or sight impairment. Having a child is a gamble, even if you do get the all clear, there are plenty of people that acquire disabilities in their lives. By all means have the screening if there is a valid risk, but be prepared for any eventuality.

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  5. #33
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    The harmony test is NOT a diagnostic test, a lot of people seem to think that because it's a genetic test that it's conclusive, it isn't. It can be and has been wrong, deal with it. Even when the tests detect trisomies, it's not conclusive, followup tests are done to make the result conclusive... and in a small amount of cases, even some of the trisomies detected by harmony have been wrong.

    We are in the same situation as some here, our harmony test came back as a girl (confirmed twice) and yet our baby has a penis. The medical establishment is trying to make sense of it and throwing possibilities around, like turners syndrome (these babies are girls and there's no record of them developing a penis in the womb, that I have found). These babies tend to be small, our baby is growing as expected, no heart issues either...

    We believe that in small instances there is an anomaly in the harmony testing as more contradicting sonograms and births surface on the net. Some one is making a terrible lot of money professing accuracy rates when again... it is not a diagnostic test, it's inconclusive!! These companies need to be regulated cos they are causing a whole lot of unnecessary stress.

    At this stage we are going with the sonographers and obs - scientists have also recently discovered that fetal dna can be found and stored in the mothers blood for years... we've had two daughters previously... really there's still much about nature that isn't known. So mums to be, if your results are incongruent to your sonogram and all else is measuring to routine? I recommend not to put your faith in the harmony test.

    Will keep you posted with our journey.

  6. #34
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    Everything has a margin of error and there is also a human factor to be considered as in, test results could have been mixed up, etc.

    I have seen gobs and gobs of inaccurate ultrasounds both for gender and also terrifying people into thinking that something was wrong with their baby that wasn't. I have also seen many false positives with the old school triple and quad screen tests. Even if the Harmony-type tests end up being less than 99% reliable, which they're new, they very well may, they are still better than the alternatives and unlike the CVS/amnio, are non-invasive.

    I am sorry that you had a bad experience with Harmony and I will be following your story, snish.

    Everyone else, I continue to urge that you have a Harmony-type test done instead of triple/quad screen, amnio, and CVS. And if your ultrasound tech seems to be saying one thing and Harmony another, the Harmony is probably correct.

    Re fetal DNA, according to my research this matters not if you have had daughters and only daughters. They will not detect a Y chromosome that isn't there if you have never carried a son. I hope you keep us posted because we do want to hear of other experiences that are outside of the norm.

    Again, I'm sorry you are having a bad experience but I simply have to reiterate that of the options available, as it sits now with the available information, Harmony-type tests are the best option. Non-invasive and much more reliable than the average person's ultrasound. (you have obviously have had some much more in depth ultrasounds than the average person does).

    Now, all you ladies reading this who are clutching at straws and now hoping your Harmony gender result was wrong...or terrified that it was wrong...please be realistic and remember that ultrasounds are wrong all the time and Harmony-type tests are way more reliable. The odds are sky high that your Harmony result is totally correct.
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  8. #35
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    Rereading this thread which was originally regarding a gal who had a false positive on the Harmony test and then went on to be absolutely overtreated for that, since she has moved on from the site let me speak a little more plainly, if any of you guys skip the blood tests and have CVS/amnio FIRST because "Harmony type tests may not be 1000% reliable" based on her experience or this new person, I'm gonna give you a stern talking to. Have the non-invasive tests first and then IF there is a problem you can have the risky ones.

    And if anyone has a normal amnio and then is so worried they go back for a CVS, like happened earlier on in this thread with the previous poster, I'm gonna come to your house and thump ya. She never should have had that done, her doctor should never have agreed to it. We have had at least two people lose perfectly healthy babies after CVS/amnio that they had for no reason other than they were 35. Non-invasive FIRST, even if they are not perfect. THEN invasive tests if a problem is detected. Don't schedule a termination based on the results of the Harmony-type tests of course, yes, occasionally can be wrong. But don't have an invasive test that can make you lose your baby without first having the non-invasive one.
    Last edited by atomic sagebrush; March 11th, 2016 at 12:53 PM.
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  10. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by atomic sagebrush View Post
    Disagree with what part???

    The fact is that these are pretty darn new tests and we probably just can't say about levels of false neg and false pos tests. They're probably going to happen in both directions

    That's not how HCG levels and XX vs XXX work. They literally were counting chromosomes in the fetal blood in your blood****** and miscounted something. Human error.

    I BEG you guys not to go rushing in to get a CVS or amnio if they are not needed. These tests may not be perfect but at the least they can tell you if you even need a more invasive test. There are people on this site who lost perfectly healthy babies because they were pressured into having these invasive tests done solely because they were over 35. I would take a false positive result on a blood test any day of the week rather than lose a healthy baby.
    I am 37 and of " advanced maternal age" lol and I was with my last also and NO WAY would I get an amnio and risk my child's life for what could be. If you really have to know then non invasive tests first and then talk about others if its indicated. I wouldn't do it either way
    Its A Girl!!



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  12. #37
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    Gt- glad your initial results look good and hope the rest put your mind at ease. You are very correct in that it is not a diagnostic tool and just a screening. I have real about false positives and women aborting and just skipping the CVS or amnio so kudos to you for seeking the truth. Def. Don't go off these results 100% if the come back positive for something. This happens with other tests and simple ultrasounds freaking women out who then go onto have healthy babes. In our search to find something wrong sometimes your gonna find it whether they are right or not
    Its A Girl!!



  13. #38
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    this is a pretty old thread, I just wanted to be more definitive than I could really be at the time regarding anyone having:

    a) an amnio instead of a Harmony/Panorama type test "because it was so stressful to get a false positive" or "they are screening, not diagnostic" (seriously why does this even MATTER, call it a hedgehog test if you want to, it's irrelevant) and

    b) no one should EVER have a CVS AND an amnio both for no effing reason. Have one or the other, not both.

    I despise threads like this where one or two bad experiences then start making everyone question what is overall a BIG technological improvement. Nothing is perfect, but because something is imperfect that does not mean that everyone should go back to old and/or invasive tests that give tons of false positives and can possibly cause miscarriages.
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  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atsaukina1 View Post
    Gt- glad your initial results look good and hope the rest put your mind at ease. You are very correct in that it is not a diagnostic tool and just a screening. I have real about false positives and women aborting and just skipping the CVS or amnio so kudos to you for seeking the truth. Def. Don't go off these results 100% if the come back positive for something. This happens with other tests and simple ultrasounds freaking women out who then go onto have healthy babes. In our search to find something wrong sometimes your gonna find it whether they are right or not
    I have also read about this and no doctor should ever abort based on Harmony/Panorama type test wihtout first having CVS or amnio. That any doctor would ever agree to such a thing is IMO malpractice.

    Have non-invasive tests first. Then if it indicates a problem, or something seems amiss (like a peener on the ultrasound), have the invasive test THEN to verify or not. And if you need to have the invasive test done, PLEASE for the love of all that is good and holy, don't have both amnio AND CVS because you only need one.
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  15. #40
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    Hi Everyone,

    Update: At 24 week scan, our baby is growing as expected, great heart beat, every inch, measured and yep, the penis is growing too.

    Experts are now proposing 3 options - that the harmony stuffed up cos it's got it wrong 4 times previously in our hospital, and our baby is a typical boy, the other is CAH, where baby has enlarged clitoris, the last is xo/xy mosaic.

    We wont know until the birth because although they are keen to know and do an amnio, we are refusing. There is absolutely no way that we will risk our baby with an invasive procedure. Our next scan will be at 32 weeks.

    Knowing sooner will not change the way we feel about our baby, so if there's an anomaly going on, we've decided to deal with it after the birthing.

    More later.

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